Beer Can Maneefol Guapo

[Michael Mayben]

Let's kick off this forum with some total bling.

Thanks to the investment of their life savings AND future blood plasma donations for three additional generations, them Ismail kids have made the Beer Can Maneefol happen for us! This is an absolutely FIRST CLASS casting, VERY nicely machined, and was done with NO core plugs through any water passages or the exhaust crossovers! AMAZING! Far nicer casting than ANYTHING ever done up by the IH foundries!

I'm not looking for any performance "upgrade", I simply wanted this so I can finally have some bling in my life...bein' OLD means I need LOTTSA bling, more the better, excess is EVERYTHING at this stage. Since I'm replacing lifters, re-sealing the lifter chamber cover, performing a bi-annual radiator repair (man I wish these IH peekup radiator core supports were more substantial!), we figgered...why not??? And...at least we could contribute some treasure back into the IH Only/RPT treasure chest so them boys and gurls could go to McDonalds occasionally! They need a break from stompin' cans and throwin' 'em in the fire pit to make casting slag for maneefols.

Since I'm kinda in charge of the dumpster detail each day at the Binder Bee, we're gonna collect all aluminum and make shore the bags end up on Mike and Deb's trailer before they leave. That way, we can ALL show our support for the effort which should prove out to be at least as guud for 'em as social security!

Mike and Deb tell me this is the BEST example of all the production units they have QC'd, and I'll be dam, they even SERIALIZED it with my name!!!! That's dam shore better deal than havin' a freeway named for me like a dead politician! And the thangs was done up in the newnited states (is LaLaLand still part of the newnited states??), NOT in Nork, or redchinamesskiko.

So I've been "accessorizing" the unit after a fashion this week when I wasn't in bed delirious with the fever. I call it redneck fang shoe. Finished the mock-up today, a few items will have to be moved over from the OEM boat anchor. The carb may or may not stay, it's a "new" Holley 4150 "reverse idle" carb, not dialed in for the 392 application but it should be close. My other carb (both are 600cfm, vacuum secondary units, with full electric choke) is real fresh also, I really wanna stick it on and go run down the road so I can see how the dial-in for it matches up with the beer can part with no other mods.

Also going back to the 1/2" aluminum spacer to insure adequate hood clearance. However, I installed the long carb mount studs so that I can install the phenolic spacer (1") if it adds any benefit after testing again.

I'd been looking at the Poweradder air filtration system for some time, way before deciding to do the beer can conversion. I had already bought a single plenum bonnet for a trial, when they introduced the dual snorkel, I returned the single and snaked another filter and 22 degree ell. Guess I shoulda gone with the red filter elements (K&N clones) but fang shoe told me enuff is enuff, too much red is NOT a guud thang. Spectre has already discontinued the "dust shields/housings" for those filter elements, I'll be on the lookout for a pair of those if any are left in the stores that handle that stuff. Those ells are gonna have to be surgically-shortened up some, but will put the elements in the cleanest part of the underhood space.

BobK and Toddj may recognize the Pete's Plug (wonder which job THOSE came from??) installed in the driver side rear coolant port location (that will be under the tranny kickdown linkage). That will give me an access point for a thermocouple stinger to monitor coolant temp at that location during "dial-in".

Since this motor is an "IC" variation, I can't use the LPG maneefol gaskets with the blocked exhaust crossovers. The IC gaskets have a restriction manufactured into the rear coolant ports and Jeff, Mike, and I figger that the hole in that restrictor is a controlling element of the IC engine cooling system, don't wanna create a problem where there is none! As always...a NEW RS 370-195 tstat is installed along with the custom gaskets I make. The "early" model truck water neck is an experiment to open up the space around the distributor for more pleasant access, Joe Duhon made that one happen for us...thanks again Joe!

I'm using one of Mike's RPT EGR blockers, not the ones I make using trained slave beavers who gnaw 'em outta scrap iron. Mike supplies ALL grade 8 hardware needed for install in black oxide...to further the blingfactor, I swapped his stuff for iridite finish grade 8 I keep on hand. The mounting holes for the divorced choke heat sink have been plugged also, using a hi-temp teflon pipe thread sealant.

Prolly won't start the actual swap for another two weeks due to the workload lined up currently, then the beatertruck goes offline for at least two weeks while I do the deed. I still need to line up a cast iron Delco distributor and convert to a Pertronix II module. I've got all the advance dial-in kits for the Delco now, but I won't swap one in until I'm sure the entire fuel/induction system pans out. Another possibility sparks-wise is to go back to the Crane XR 3000 system which worked so nicely in the past.

One of the pics is the "before" shot for reference. The beatermobile looks like crap on the outside (it's a log snaker after all!!), but hopefully she'll end up REAL flashy under her skirt! Gotta make them Ismailbubbas proud of the old man!

Stay tuned for further developments....

[Michael Mayben]

Weell...I already scruud up, this new version of the software is gonna have a learnin' curve for the old man.

Here's the "before" shot for reference.

One more thang...I don't EVEN wanna hear the term "EFI" mentioned in this forum, the only 'lectrics allowed on the carb forum will have to do with 'lectric CHOKES! 'Lectric sparkmakers is OK, we gotta have sparks to lite them fires in the holes, but if anyone wants a spelin' lesson for "EFI"...then go play on THAT forum!

Them fuel rail towers on the beer can unit are gonna be drilled and tapped to make some real nice attachment points for Adel clamps holdin' up the sparkharness.

[Erik Socha]

Mike,

That maneefol looks great.....

[Michael Mayben]

Yep Eric!!!!

I can't say ENUFF about the quality of the RPT beer can breathing apparatus! It makes the rest of the IH-supplied castings look like pure CRAP! The "early" versions I eyeballed last summer were REAL NICE and more than acceptable to me...this one is SUPERB!

In fact...I'm gonna do some surgery on that IH-supply thermostat housing to absolve it from doing doubleduty onna 152/196. Then paint it up real purty so it looks "billet" bling too!

The pics are just the mock-up stage, somma the stuff will stick, some will git tossed and replaced!

I'm really interested in how that clear ceramic coat stuff hangs around on the crossover on "Ido"'s gas squirter application. I know that powder coat on the cast iron manifold crossovers burns off just as quick as rattlecan.

I'm thinkin' now about doin' up ANOTHER maneefol...that one will go on display (under glass of course) on the coffee table in my new office/gun room/fly tying sanctuary that's ALSO a work in progress!

[Michael Mayben]

Gotta buncha other stuff going on...but I did git the Adel clamps mounted up for the wiring harness. Bolts don't match, but they will after a town trip tomorrow.

The Gates 20846 radiator hose for that old school top water neck should be here tomorrow also, that will complete the entire plumbing package

[ldo_marlin]

Originally Posted by Michael Mayben

Yep Eric!!!!

I'm really interested in how that clear ceramic coat stuff hangs around on the crossover on "Ido"'s gas squirter application. I know that powder coat on the cast iron manifold crossovers burns off just as quick as rattlecan.

Yep I am anxious to find out. It better hold up well with heat as advertised by the shop.

Your intake setup looks real BLING!

Noticed you are using a square bore Holley. Is there a reason you went with a squarebore vs. Q-jet?

[Michael Mayben]

Well Ido...a purty simple reason for a Holley modular...I play with 'em for my hobbyjob!

I was NEVER enamored of Quadrajets back when they was born, though I used to play with Rochester 2CG mixers on Tripower Panchos a bunch. Always felt that the Quadras were throwaway smogerators and "dial-in" parts have never been real available for 'em. And I ALWAYS know that they are/were beholden to GM (Rochester that is)...I DON'T allow any GM stuff IN my shop at my old age (parking lot is OK). And ya ain't been able to buy new ones in quite some time, the JET stuff leaves me cold, no WAY I'd ever pay that kinda money for any mixer!

I can acquire dam near any replacement or dial-in part for a Holley modular at 7-11 and if they don't have what I need in the refrigerated case or Big Gulp island for 'em, the BIG Holley warehouse in Portland can have stuff to me next day! It's too EZ to NOT luv 'em!

I considered doing a spreadbore maneefol to just make thangs EZ on Mike and Deb...but I'd be forced to use an adapter, I DON'T believe in those! I've got a MAJOR investment in Holley infrastructure here, I ain't takin' that horse to the killin' house yet!

So...I guess ya can say I'm racially prejudiced AGAINST anything that says...."Rochester"!

Holley spreadbores are WAY TOO MUCH dinero for NO GAIN!!! Way too WEIRD for me to scruu with and there is NO MARKET for 'em! I can "make" one fit the IH intake but it just ain't worth it.

Once Mike gits a "remote"-mount SV thermostat housing dun up...that will make MANY other carb/air filter combos something to consider, the OEM housing/neck is a VERY limiting factor as it sits for both ignition systems and carb choices.

[ldo_marlin]

Amen on the parts avail. & simplicity of Holley carbs!

I was asking from a fuel efficiency point of spreadbore vs. square bore. But if you're a master at tuning carbs you can get good mileage out of either. A big deal these days with current gas prices.

[ihojeff]

Looks great Michael. I really like the air filter intake set-up that you're going to run.

[Michael Mayben]

This project AIN'T DEAD! I jes' been BIZEE with other stuff!

And for a "related" thread, check here:
Engine Temp and Pete's Plugs

Momma is finally due home with the OTHER DD tomorrow night, so once I have a reglar ride to git to town for parts, the beater comes apart, hopefully start rippin' and shreddin' on Sunday after a cooling system flush. I've got two weeks set aside for this...I ain't on the clock no more and it dam shore ain't a git'erdun kinda deal! And it's time for the bi-annual radiator solder job, these dam D body rigs are real flexy fliers in the core support area which leads to major stress on the radiator/shroud, I got the urethane mounts for the radiator so I'll make up that workaround this time and see if it makes any difference in the long term.

Need to work out the bugs before we leave for the IHSTO "High Cascades" trail ride on June 23.

[Michael Mayben]

OK, the beater is currently out of action, can't make the weekly garbage run to the dump this week.

Started off with a cooling system flush, it's been exactly two years since the last one. I use that "Gunk" brand cleaner as I feel it's the strongest, most effective product available in a non-commercial product. I also run the stuff for about two hours by driving the rig with the product (and straight water) in the system before doing the backflush process.

The pics show the inside of some of the cooling system parts, they are STERILE, no scale or scum, only the rough casting surface! The bright rust seen is the result of the parts drying in the atmosphere after draining and being opened up, that stuff wipes away with a rag.

Removing the heat sink for the divorced choke stove can be a real PITA if ya wanna preserve it. And it needs to come off to allow access to the retaining bolt underneath. I use a hand impact driver for that with a hex bit (4mm fits PERFECTLY when tapped into place and is really tight in the recess). As ya can see, the ends of those OEM flathead screws protrude right into the crossover passage and have been eaten away over the years from exhaust gases, they are NOT "special" screws with tapered ends!

Since I'm not re-installing the heat sink, it's been placed in my pile of parts that others may have need of in the future.

[Michael Mayben]

Tim Potter's comments about the position of the Pete's Plug in the beer can unit were correct! My plan to modify the throttle cable/pressure control linkage to allow access just won't work out with any kind of benefit overall and ain't worth the effort.

So I've moved the Pete's to the opposite side, adjacent to the heater core supply fitting.

I'm currently removing one of the thermostat housing mounting ears (used only on 152/196 apps) to allow a bit more clearance for the primary fuel bowl on the Holley 4160. And at this point, it appears the "early" water neck I've prepped will work out fine.

Once the OEM maneefol was outta the way, found another surprise regarding the ORIGINAL gaskets (never been off before) as confirmed by the "factory" red paint patterns . This is an IC motor, should have "restrictions" manufactured into the gaskets at the rear coolant passages. As can be seen, those restrictions have all but disappeared over the years due to turbulence/erosion! A portion of one was stuck in the head passage. This is exactly what I figgered would be the case after I first eyeballed the new, replacement gaskets, no way restricting those passages can be a PERMANENT workaround with the implementation of the "IC" 392 revision. If IH wanted to restrict those passages, that shoulda been done with "plugs" or restrictors, NOT by using dam piece of sheet metal! Cheeep, cheeep, CHEEEP!

Ya can see a comparison of the new IC gaskets with NON-IC parts for a LPG application (blocked exhaust heat crossover).

So this motor has been running what are essentially non-IC gaskets for MANY years/miles. And of course...with NO engine cooling issues at all. So...based upon that finding, I'm going to go ahead and use the propane gaskets as I feel the benefit of the blocked exhaust crossovers warrant experimenting with that. And most likely, the IC gasket coolant passage restrictions would disappear in short order anyway!

Next on the list is an initial cleanup of the valley pan area before removal. This motor has been pukin' about a quart every 250 miles most recently, oil's droolin' from all around the gasket interface, and the PCV grommet is rotten also. Once that area is clean, the pan will come off along with the valve covers to allow lifter replacement, that's the subject of the next installment but may be several days away, Tim Page is due in this weekend for another course at Binder U., he's now working on some credits towards a major in TF 727 slushbox tranny overhaul.

[ihojeff]

Michael,

When installing the propane gaskets keep in mind the engine will take longer to warm up. This might be a bad thing if you drive in cold weather a lot.

Aside from that the intanko redo is looking sweet!

[Michael Mayben]

Well Jeff...I've been going back and forth over the "intake gasket" dilemma.

Warmup on this rig has never been an issue with the electric choke, and the fact there is no "heated" air intake snorkel, nor is there a functional heat riser, it went away many years ago. It's set for a few days at -7f and had no problem starting at those temps. Goes right onto fast idle and it gradually falls off just like EFI as the engine temp comes up.

I'm gonna go ahead with the propane gaskets for now and see what happens, since this is most likely a work in progress as I work through maximizing the potential of this intake combo.

We got Tim's tranny in pieces and a parts list developed, now it's back to the beater.

All the OEM lifters came outta their holes fairly easily except for one (the one that leaks down overnight), that one was really varnished up. Had to do the PB Blaster/carb spray cocktail on it several times as I worked it out, ended up having to rig the lifter slapper on it, just barely fit under the brake booster. Two whacks and it pops out too.

While pulling the OEM lifters, I had the new units in a ATF soak overnight, periodically pumped 'em to expel the air and kept 'em submerged until each was withdrawn for install. Used Sta-Lube engine assembly gunk at the cam/lifter interface, moly and graphite compound with a heavy dose of zinc.

Using the spanner wrench to depress the rockers one-by-one, the pushrods went back in quickly, turned the engine over one rev with the remote button to allow all pushrods to be loaded.

Then came mega-cleanup time. Friday morning I received a surprise package from Fred Demmon (hangs on the Binder Bulletin). Fred's a distributor for Winzer automotive and industrial supplies out of Pearland, TX. MANY years ago, I used Wurth/Winzer products in the vo-tech shops and in my own businesses, very high quality stuff, most especially their hardware line.

Welcome to Winzer Corporation

Fred sent me a sample package of many different Winzer distributed products, including a can of a citrus-base "gel" type degreaser. Since I was ready to douche the valley cover and valve covers, I thought I'd give it a try. I've used MANY similar products over the years and always felt they were a complete waste of money. Tim's tranny was REALLY grungy, so it was a real test.

Sprayed the stuff on the parts and stood by and watched it go to work, I could immediately see the crap melting off!

Then I fired up the pressure washer and blasted hell outta the whole pile. What an amazing product that Winzer guapo is!!! I've NEVER seen anything like that actually work but bubba, this stuff DOES!

Then today, it was time to tackle the really cruddy valve covers for a re-paint. Used the Winzer paint/gasket stripper on 'em and just like the other stuff, the many layers of all kinds of paint, gasket material, and baked-on grease just melted away. Rinsed it off with water, hit a few spots with the wire brushes and then shot 'em with rattlecan. Real EZ!

Thanks again Fred! Makes a real difference in using "pro" grade shop supplies instead of wallyworldguapo!!!

The throttle pressure control has been sterilized and painted also, and the air plenum is now fitted up to the carb. I've also re-worked the carb fuel delivery plumbing considerably to make it a little easier to pull maintenance on.

The valley cover was painted and then sealed to the valley, most critical is using the n=4 thin head screws Mike supplies with the beer can maneefol kit to replace the OEM bolts in the center two postions on either side of the valley cover. Otherwise, the beer can rig won't sit flush against the intake gaskets and seal on the heads.

Waiting now for the paint to dry so the valve covers can go back on, then the lightweight unit can be dropped in place.

I've decided to git her percolatin' again now, and then pull the radiator next week. I've got a fresh shroud for it that needs a tiny bit of fiberglas repair so that will be done in the mean time and then installed after I repair the radiator yet again, and install the new urethane radiator mounts.

More to come...

[Michael Mayben]

All the cleanup and paint work has been completed until the radiator comes out for Phase 2.

The throttle pressure control is now sterile and will function more smoothly with a change in the dual throttle return spring anchor point.

The thermostat housing had a non-essential ear whacked off and the housing ground down as much as possible. The casting gets real thin in that area so ya don't wanna got too far and waste it.

The valve covers have been re-installed also, along with a fresh PCV and a clean flame arrestor. All the PCV and vacuum plumbing will be re-routed somewhat in order to clean things up, the new brass fittings are now in the maneefol since I'm well past the mock-up stage!

Hope to drop the mixer parts on tomorrow and light her off.